Comments on: The Silence of the Tribes http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/ knowing how to win wars since before 1993 Fri, 22 Aug 2008 00:07:56 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.1.2 By: Chief RZ http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127511 Chief RZ Thu, 02 Nov 2006 01:50:45 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127511 First, the missing person was an interpreter from the area, next, remember, we are there at the request of the Iraqi government. We can leave. Compromises are....good and bad. At least this is not the thousands someone left in Vietnam, USSR, Japan, Korea, and several other locations. First, the missing person was an interpreter from the area, next, remember, we are there at the request of the Iraqi government. We can leave.
Compromises are….good and bad.
At least this is not the thousands someone left in Vietnam, USSR, Japan, Korea, and several other locations.

]]> By: canuckistani http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127512 canuckistani Thu, 02 Nov 2006 02:08:02 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127512 I'd say it's because "No Man Left Behind" is Hollywood bullcrap, rather than a realistic policy. The fact is that people get left behind in war all the time, especially when things are going badly. I'm thinking of Bataan and the Battle of the Bulge in particular, but every time you see "missing" on a casualty report, that's someone who was left behind. But it makes good drama in Chuck Norris movies, doesn't it? I’d say it’s because “No Man Left Behind” is Hollywood bullcrap, rather than a realistic policy. The fact is that people get left behind in war all the time, especially when things are going badly. I’m thinking of Bataan and the Battle of the Bulge in particular, but every time you see “missing” on a casualty report, that’s someone who was left behind.
But it makes good drama in Chuck Norris movies, doesn’t it?

]]> By: Bill from INDC http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127513 Bill from INDC Thu, 02 Nov 2006 02:31:32 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127513 Well, there is the possibility that the Army has information that the interpreter really ran off with his new wife. This is total speculation. But I don't know what I don't know. Shrug. Well, there is the possibility that the Army has information that the interpreter really ran off with his new wife. This is total speculation. But I don’t know what I don’t know. Shrug.

]]> By: Bill from INDC http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127514 Bill from INDC Thu, 02 Nov 2006 02:35:13 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127514 <blockquote>I’d say it’s because “No Man Left Behind” is Hollywood bullcrap, rather than a realistic policy. </blockquote> You don't know jack shit about military history. American military policy undertakes enormous risk to recover not only missing personnel, but dead bodies, <em>all the time.</em> Like when Task Force Ranger stayed in Mogadishu for hours to recover Cliff Wolcott's body, which was pinned in the downed Blackhawk. In large actions it's not always possible, but it's done - often - to a point where even I question its logic.

I’d say it’s because “No Man Left Behind” is Hollywood bullcrap, rather than a realistic policy.

You don’t know jack **** about military history.

American military policy undertakes enormous risk to recover not only missing personnel, but dead bodies, all the time. Like when Task Force Ranger stayed in Mogadishu for hours to recover Cliff Wolcott’s body, which was pinned in the downed Blackhawk. In large actions it’s not always possible, but it’s done - often - to a point where even I question its logic.

]]> By: JimK http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127515 JimK Thu, 02 Nov 2006 03:31:54 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127515 I read that this guy was working with the US military, not a member of it. Is that true? Is he Iraqi? I don't think Sully is telling the whole truth on ANYTHING, so I would like to know the whole story before I get mad. I read that this guy was working with the US military, not a member of it. Is that true? Is he Iraqi? I don’t think Sully is telling the whole truth on ANYTHING, so I would like to know the whole story before I get mad.

]]> By: JimK http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127516 JimK Thu, 02 Nov 2006 03:39:54 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127516 I just did some Googling. This story is odd. I can't find a news story that mentions the missing guy's name, or branch of service or anything. It's just "A missing American soldier." Does that strike anyone else as odd? What I did find is that he's an American of Iraqi descent, married to an Iraqi woman (like, in Iraq). He's a translator. Also, the Iraqi Prime Minister ordered the Coalition out of Sadr City. Aren't we telling teh world we are in Iraq at the behest of the official, legitimate government? Sully mentions the word "nuances" and then ignores any and all facts that don't support the "Bush is evil and left a man to die" theory. I don't buy anything Sullivan sells these days without careful inspection. I just did some Googling. This story is odd. I can’t find a news story that mentions the missing guy’s name, or branch of service or anything. It’s just “A missing American soldier.” Does that strike anyone else as odd?

What I did find is that he’s an American of Iraqi descent, married to an Iraqi woman (like, in Iraq). He’s a translator.

Also, the Iraqi Prime Minister ordered the Coalition out of Sadr City. Aren’t we telling teh world we are in Iraq at the behest of the official, legitimate government?

Sully mentions the word “nuances” and then ignores any and all facts that don’t support the “Bush is evil and left a man to die” theory. I don’t buy anything Sullivan sells these days without careful inspection.

]]> By: The Sanity Inspector http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127517 The Sanity Inspector Thu, 02 Nov 2006 03:54:53 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127517 Even if the guy was a Filipino mess orderly, attached to the Army on a civilian service contract, I'd still want us to do everything we can to rescue him. It does feel very wrong and stomach-churning, knowing that we've been prevented from searching for him, and that the next view of him we get might be in a video posted on ogrish.com. OTOH, the Israelis kicked the everlovin' dogshit out of their neighbors when their soldiers were kidnapped, and came up with nothing. So, there's no guarantees. Fortunes of war, we'll have to chalk it up to. Even if the guy was a Filipino mess orderly, attached to the Army on a civilian service contract, I’d still want us to do everything we can to rescue him. It does feel very wrong and stomach-churning, knowing that we’ve been prevented from searching for him, and that the next view of him we get might be in a video posted on ogrish.com.

OTOH, the Israelis kicked the everlovin’ dogshit out of their neighbors when their soldiers were kidnapped, and came up with nothing. So, there’s no guarantees. Fortunes of war, we’ll have to chalk it up to.

]]> By: In Search Of Utopia http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127518 In Search Of Utopia Thu, 02 Nov 2006 04:01:11 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127518 <strong>Two guys I respect... Hell I even admire them...</strong> First John Cole, who has always had my respect, and always called bullshit when he saw it. Last word on Kerry...Goes to John Derbyshire (who must have a book to sell!): John Kerry is awful, and anything we can do... Two guys I respect… Hell I even admire them…

First John Cole, who has always had my respect, and always called bullshit when he saw it. Last word on Kerry…Goes to John Derbyshire (who must have a book to sell!): John Kerry is awful, and anything we can do…

]]> By: John B http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127519 John B Thu, 02 Nov 2006 05:12:43 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127519 al Sadr tells Maliki to get the US to back off of Sadr City. Maliki tells the US and the US obliges. Who is in charge here? al Sadr tells Maliki to get the US to back off of Sadr City. Maliki tells the US and the US obliges.

Who is in charge here?

]]> By: Gabrielle http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127521 Gabrielle Thu, 02 Nov 2006 06:40:34 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127521 Well, I'm pissed off, W is in a bind. This is sooo painful, but the Army's policy is to not fraternize with the natives. Even the wedding pictures were floating around Baghdad. I guess this really pissed off al Sadr. Now we know who is really running things over there. What should we do. I say it is time for one of our fabulous snipers to go to work, as they should have 2 years ago, but W pulled the plug on that one too. Well, I’m pissed off, W is in a bind. This is sooo painful, but the Army’s policy is to not fraternize with the natives. Even the wedding pictures were floating around Baghdad. I guess this really pissed off al Sadr. Now we know who is really running things over there. What should we do. I say it is time for one of our fabulous snipers to go to work, as they should have 2 years ago, but W pulled the plug on that one too.

]]> By: John the Marine http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127523 John the Marine Thu, 02 Nov 2006 13:42:10 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127523 Gabrielle, You've hit the nail on the head. Where are our collective "balls"? I'm sick of the U.S.'s inability to get tough with creeps like sadr. Gabrielle, You’ve hit the nail on the head. Where are our collective “balls”? I’m sick of the U.S.’s inability to get tough with creeps like sadr.

]]> By: commissar http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127524 commissar Thu, 02 Nov 2006 14:21:43 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127524 JimK, Per IBC, his name is Ahmed Qusai al-Taei. The DoD reported a <a href="http://www.mnf-iraq.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=6719&Itemid=21" rel="nofollow">soldier missing here</a>. JimK,

Per IBC, his name is Ahmed Qusai al-Taei. The DoD reported a soldier missing here.

]]> By: canuckistani http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127525 canuckistani Thu, 02 Nov 2006 14:50:14 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127525 <blockquote>In large actions it’s not always possible</blockquote> That's all I'm saying, although it's equally true of small actions; anywhere where a retreat is necessary, there's a chance of leaving people behind. And I'm sure the army does its best, and tries extra hard when any prisoners will end up having their heads sawn off on the internet, but grown ups realize that in a war, bad shit can happen, and hard choices have to made by the commanders on the spot. How many more men have to die, and how badly can you afford to piss off the Shiite militias* to get back one man who is probably already dead, in Ramadi, or both? *not to mention the Iraqi government, but I think that's probably a lesser consideration.

In large actions it’s not always possible

That’s all I’m saying, although it’s equally true of small actions; anywhere where a retreat is necessary, there’s a chance of leaving people behind. And I’m sure the army does its best, and tries extra hard when any prisoners will end up having their heads sawn off on the internet, but grown ups realize that in a war, bad **** can happen, and hard choices have to made by the commanders on the spot. How many more men have to die, and how badly can you afford to piss off the Shiite militias* to get back one man who is probably already dead, in Ramadi, or both?

*not to mention the Iraqi government, but I think that’s probably a lesser consideration.

]]> By: rbj http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127526 rbj Thu, 02 Nov 2006 15:04:34 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127526 Yes this story is bizarre: http://story.news.ask.com//article/20061102/D8L5046O0.html An Iraqi-American, reserve soldier, married to an Iraqi. Apparently there are discussions going on to get his release. And while we do have to accept Maliki as Iraqi PM, we should have taken out Sadr earlier, when we had the chance. Yes this story is bizarre:
http://story.news.ask.com//article/20061102/D8L5046O0.html

An Iraqi-American, reserve soldier, married to an Iraqi. Apparently there are discussions going on to get his release. And while we do have to accept Maliki as Iraqi PM, we should have taken out Sadr earlier, when we had the chance.

]]> By: In Search Of Utopia http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127528 In Search Of Utopia Thu, 02 Nov 2006 17:15:52 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127528 <strong>Sign of the Times</strong> I thank God that there are people like Frank Schaeffer: I'm a Christian, a writer, a military parent and a registered Republican. On all those counts, I was disgusted by an e-mail I just received that's being circulated by campaign... Sign of the Times

I thank God that there are people like Frank Schaeffer: I’m a Christian, a writer, a military parent and a registered Republican. On all those counts, I was disgusted by an e-mail I just received that’s being circulated by campaign…

]]> By: JimK http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127530 JimK Thu, 02 Nov 2006 21:27:10 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127530 Commisar: thanks for finding his name. i don't know why, but it was important to me. I'm starting to think that someone knows more than is being fed to the press. It just doesn't mesh that we'd leave someone. Something is going on. Or I hope so, at least, because the alternative is that the guy in charge of U.S. forces in Iraq just left a man behind. Commisar: thanks for finding his name. i don’t know why, but it was important to me.

I’m starting to think that someone knows more than is being fed to the press. It just doesn’t mesh that we’d leave someone. Something is going on.

Or I hope so, at least, because the alternative is that the guy in charge of U.S. forces in Iraq just left a man behind.

]]> By: CDR Salamander http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127531 CDR Salamander Thu, 02 Nov 2006 21:41:59 +0000 http://acepilots.com/mt/2006/11/01/the-silence-of-the-tribes/#comment-127531 Everyone would be well advised not to assume they have all the information they need to make a judgement at this point in time. That's all. Everyone would be well advised not to assume they have all the information they need to make a judgement at this point in time. That’s all.

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